The Comforter is the Spirit of Truth that shall comfort us as those we leave behind shall persecute us in their unbelief and wrath that we have left their church. They are not still future. That is, Ezekiel 39 and Revelation 19 also appear to be parallel as apparent eschatological events of predictive prophecy, since both chapters also mention the birds of prey devouring those judged on earth at that time. Resurrection Accounts Resurrection of Christ, Thus says the LORD, Let not a wise man boast of his wisdom, and let not the mighty man boast of his might, let not a rich man boast of his riches; but let him who boasts boast of this, that he understands and knows Me . Check out ourBible Answerspage for more information on a variety of topics. I know this is an old post but I have a few comments. We have 3 groups of people here. (14) And Lot went out, and spake unto his sons Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left. Why is this the case? Noah were, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. "( Matthew 24:38 NRSV, Luke 17:26). Two women shall be grinding together; the one, Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers. replied to them, Where the dead body[e] is, there the vultures will indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the John 14:29-31 KJV (29) And now I have told you before it come to This is the correct interpretation of one taken and the other left. February 27, 2023 equitable estoppel california No Comments . That was Jesus context when He said it would be like this at the coming of the Son of Man. For more on the secret rapture: Can you give me the Bible support for the Secret Rapture? Who is the one taken? There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. Is it referring to the Rapture? That is, birds of prey visible in the heavens congregate and devour corpses on earth. and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in Their own words will come back upon them to destroy them. Copyright Like The Master Ministries. Luke 17:34 and Matthew 24:40 both describe events that will occur at the Goat and Sheep Judgment. There are many Antichrists but one body of Christ. Many people use these words to support a concept called the rapture. 35 Two women will be grinding grain together; one will be taken and the other left. Inded, welcome! destroyed all of them 30 it will be like that on the day that the Son The words quoted in Luke 17 come after the Lord had answered the Pharisees question about the timing of the Kingdom of God. One will be taken and the other left. Recovering from a blunder I made while emailing a professor. Big difference. In Lot's case, his wife looked back as she did not want to give up on her life of comfort she had back in Sodom, she was consequently "taken" The fire that destroyed Sodom is another parallel on how God will destroy the world in the end with fire. (34) I tell you, in the other left. [31] [32] [33]IGN deu 8 de 10, dizendo "Atomic Heart uma tentativa altamente imaginativa, inspirada no atompunk, de continuar de onde BioShock parou.." This is because the dead have already risen by Luke 17:37. I believe that the context in Luke is about not being like Lots wife an having one foot in the kingdom and one foot still back in Sodom , you will be left for destruction. by John Dart October 26, 2011 Guest Post What Is the Difference Between 'Man' And 'Son of Man' in Num 23:19? , Jesus prophesies the events immediately preceding His return to this earth and the resurrection of Gods faithful people: "For as the lightning that flashes out of one part under heaven shines to the other part under heaven, so also the Son of Man will be in His dayTwo women will be grinding together: the one will be taken and the other left. The point is that people were occupied with activities and were not aware or willing to believe Noah, and that will happen to the last generation before Christ returns. We would do well to expand the context of the passage under consideration by going to verse 20 in the same chapter, where the Pharisees questioned Jesus about when the kingdom of God was coming. If angels really have these wings, or if they are symbolic for ability of flight, is up for discussion. Genesis 19:9-15 KJV (9) And they said, Stand back. Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together.. 22 He said to the disciples, "The days will come when you will yearn to see one of the days of the Son of Man, . And he said unto them, wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together (Luke 17:37). They came and went: [Act 3:24-25 YLT] 24 and also all the prophets from Samuel and those following in order, as many as spake, did also foretell of these days. In the gospel of Matthew, we find that Jesus was also discussing His second coming just before Matthew 24:40. If the allusion is also literal, then these birds of prey may refer to Rev 19:17-18 and Ezek 39:17-20, but in such a case, the salient meaning of this passage in context would remain the same (i.e., judgment on earth evident from heaven). Revelation 14:10 KJV (10) The same shall drink of the wine of the Real Answers. A remnant will survive. Can you give me the Bible support for the Secret Rapture? Remember Lots wife!". Nevertheless it is of the utmost importance to remember that both passages before us are addressed to Israel. Two shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Jesus: being symbolised at the dead copse, point of interest, (,,not meaning/saying, He's a dead Copse) lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of the city. son in law, and thy sons, and thy How do I align things in the following tabular environment? being evil, speak good things? Luke 17. (Matthew 24:28). (34-35) cannot refer to the rapture as it is commonly taught, which is said to take place before the Second Coming. Is it possible to create a concave light? 38 For as in those And Noah and Lot are used as examples of those left behind and surviving destruction; Noah survived the flood but everyone else was destroyed and Lot survived the fiery brimstone but everyone else was destroyed. Luke-21:25-34-kjv. It is also agreed that the words were spoken to Jewish disciples BEFORE the Church began on the day of Pentecost. Points 10 and 11 (Luke 17:34-35) say that "one will be taken and the other left" and this is the Rapture. and hath nothing in me.*. Come quickly, Lord Jesus! Luke 17:34 (NASB), I tell you, in that night there will be two men in one bed: the one will be taken and the other will be left. Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together (Luke17:37). What was the role of Timothy in the infant church? This is the great judgment/wrath at Christ's Second Coming, when God kills His enemies and instructs scavenger-birds to gather and eat their corpses (Revelation 19:17-21). Many will resist what He has to say with a multitude of evil words that will fly out of their mouths into the "air". I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Luke 17:35 (NASB). At the very same moment the head of the Revived Roman Empire will sign a 7 year peace treaty and Jews will be able to rebuild their temple. (h) Vid. whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. Here is Jesus' answer to the "when question," which I have paraphrased quite liberally: The day to which you are referring concerns the denouement of the Son of Man on the "Day of the Lord" which the prophets of old predicted. Because Jesus Christ is the spotless Lamb of God who took away the sins of the world (John 1:29-34) by dying upon the cross, being buried and rising again as He promised (Matthew 16:21-23, 17:22-23; Mark 8:31-33, 9:30-32; Luke 9:21-22, 18:31-34), we now possess through Him the hope and reality of our own resurrection. This is definately an idiom or para-phrased statement!. so this is clearly not a case of people being taken up to heaven or anything like that. In this respect, if we continue to compare Luke with Matthew, the ones "taken" (Matt 24:40-41, NASB) are similar to those "taken" at the flood of Noah (Matt 24:39, NASB). wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter First, this teaching does not align with the separation of the sheep from the goats in Matthew 25:31-46. The believers that are taken are not to look back (remember Lots wife) to their churches but just leave it all behind. Vultures devour. The body is the dead body of unbelievers we are to leave behind in order to follow Jesus. Why have different Bibles translated the Greek word duodifferently? (36) Two men Jesus' word picture of one aspect of the Day of the Lord is gruesome, indeed, but at some point in human history there will be a holocaust of such unimaginable scope and scale that perhaps a third--or more--of the entire population of the world will be decimated (see Revelation 6:7-8 and 9:15-18). 2) The Great Tribulation at Point 3. Matthew 13:30 . Next, Jesus said once again one will be taken and one left. All Sermons Bible Studies Devotionals Prayers. de Lectis Veter. One will be taken and the other left. will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but Two women will be grinding together: the one will be taken and the other left. One day many years ago, I prayed earnestly to understand Jesus answer in Luke 17:37, and He answered my prayer using Scripture. " I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the There is no rapture here. And also consider in the next passage the birds of prey where they are doing the devouring and the sequence of events. " (12) I have yet many things to say unto you, but ye cannot For more information on the Goat and Sheep Judgment, please read, When and where does the Goat and Sheep judgment occur? This is also called the Judgment of the Nations. Two women will be grinding at the mill; one will be taken and one will be left. Points 10 and 11 (Luke 17:34-35) say that "one will be taken and the other left" and this is the Rapture. The New International Version (NIV) has avoided the word men and so translates the passage with people. Here is the verse, I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. this place: (13) For we will destroy this place, because the cry of When Jesus discusses the cost of discipleship in Luke who are the kings at war and what do they symbolize? This is exactly whats found in Revelation 19:17-18, 21; and Ezekiel 39:4, 17-20. Rapture Doesnt Luke 17:34-36 support the secret rapture belief? Luke 17:34 describes what will happen after the judgment. We all agree on that point. 35 There will be two women grinding together. Like in the wheat and the weeds parable. There we discover Luke 17:30-35 and Matthew 24:37-41 are illustrations of the Judgment of the Nations, which is also called the Sheep and Goat Judgment (Matthew 25:31-46). Luke 17:30-37 KJV (30) Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son One commentator states that Nowhere does the Olivet Discourse deal with the Rapture. So, to answer the question: "Who are taken, and who are left behind, and how are we to understand Luke 17:37?" Every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give an account thereof in the Day of Judgment. Because this Greek word has been used in a judgment passage of . Now in Luke 17:33 Jesus says "Whosoever shall seek to gain his life shall lose it: but whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it", In other words the people "taken" are believers (like Lot's wife) who unfortunately are seeking to preserve their life by sadly being attached like Lot's wife was to her lifestyle in Sodom. But he seemed as one that We must leave their "church"we must depart in this coming time so that the Wicked shall be revealed and their judgment is executed. For a more complete explanation, please see Judgment of the Nations, also called the Sheep and Goat Judgment. free and bond, both small and great. (8) And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the The Holy Spirit chose the words of Scripture and any interpretation must faithfully interpret those words in their literal meaning. The eagles are the MULTITUDE of the words spoken by the unbelievers as they will persecute those who leave their churches for the Word of Truth when they hear and receive it with joy. By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. These are events that will take place after the Second Coming of Christ. The words in question are very similar in both passages: Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Therefore, we do not know if Jesus was referring to two men, two women or just two people, such as a married couple. Why did the disciples have so much trouble recognizing Jesus after his resurrection? Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Who is the second? shalt be condemned. will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. tree is known by his fruit. Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and with a loud voice he called to all the birds that fly directly overhead, "Come, gather for the great supper of God, to eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of captains, the flesh of mighty men, the flesh of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all men, both free and slave, both small and great." Luke 17:34 (NIV). the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies gathered to make war against him who was sitting on the horse and against his army. In this case, people who are taken maybe the living ones. How to follow the signal when reading the schematic? not open the mouth to render evil for their evil. Check your inbox or spam folder to confirm your subscription. And he said unto In the same way it would be wrong to say Jesus was not speaking of the Church when He spoke of other sheep which are not of this fold. Thank you! 1) Jesus did speak of the Rapture and of the Church before He died even though the Disciple could not understand it. Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy We must also leave the churches of the unbelievers in this coming time or be consumed in the iniquity of the city as we may render evil for their evil if we stay too long. 04 Mar 2023 00:06:00 We must hear the command and ARISE (just like Lot was commanded to "ARISE" and go from Sodom) from the dead body of unbelievers and let us go from here.their churches. As for the "where question," Jesus' apparently cryptic answer is really quite straightforward. If I can be shown to be wrong from scripture then I will be happy to be corrected. This was not an answer given in the previous discussion of this question; I basically agree with your conclusion-there is no other way of interpreting 'eagle' except as a bird of prey, consequently, those 'taken' by the eagles are where eagles go to devour their flesh-certainly no picture of anything that looks like heaven. After Jesus said, one would be taken and the other left, the disciples asked where they would be left. If you se vultures you know where the corpses are. Those who were taken were those who remained in the city and were taken by the Roman army. ERROR: CREATE MATERIALIZED VIEW WITH DATA cannot be executed from a function, Doubling the cube, field extensions and minimal polynoms. But, when asked where are those who are taken go, He cryptically says, "Where the body is, there the eagles will be gathered.". What does the verse mean? And the beast was captured, and with it the false prophet who in its presence had done the signs by which he deceived those who had received the mark of the beast and those who worshiped its image. They will show that they do not know the Lord by their evil words and actions against those who will receive the Word of Truth in faith. 34 I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. shall lose his life shall preserve it. The same statement is found in Matthew 24:28 except that the word "body" is replaced with "carcase". "And they answered and said to Him, Where, Lord? So He said to them, Luke 17:34-37 (NIV84) 34 "I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. Their very own words will eat the flesh of those who will (in unbelief) resist what the Spirit says in this coming time in the Day of Judgment. promises to Israel as a people and nation (see next tenet) are not the same as for the Bride of Christ, the Church. In Matthew 24, when it speaks about the Tribulation, it states that: wheresoever the carcase (ptoma) is, there will the eagles be gathered together. What I put forward is not my view but what the text clearly teaches. , 37 "And they answered and said to Him, Where, Lord? So He said to What he appears to be saying is that the "where" of the events of that "great and terrible Day of the Lord" (Malachi 4:5) will be evident by the human carnage taking place all over the earth, and wherever there is human carnage there will be carrion-eating birds (more likely vultures than eagles) feasting on the flesh of human corpses. Two shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Unfortunately these are the people that have missed or not heeded the warning of Jesus to "flee to the mountains" after the unveiling of the abomination of desolation. Luke makes allusion to the same people but instead of "taken" (as appears in the NASB of Matthew) Luke mentions the "destruction" of those at the time of the flood (Luke 17:27, NASB). at the door of the house with blindness, both small and great: so that So those taken were killed in flood. 17:37 1881 Westcott-Hort New Testament (WHNU), 37 Then there will be two men in the field; one will be taken and one will be left. Why is this sentence from The Great Gatsby grammatical? So what does it mean that "the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city"? Then there will be two men in the field; one will be taken and one will be left. THE RAPTURE, A SECRET UNTIL JESUS CHRIST REVEALED IT TO PAUL Attempting to argue against those who say Jesus never preached about the Rapture, people will take Jesus' words in Matthew 24:40-41 and Luke 17:34-36 about individuals being taken away, and make them apply to people being taken to heaven in the Rapture. There will be persecutions coming from the group we leave behind as they will think it strange that we no longer run with them in their church things. The "brightness of His presence" = the keeping of His sacrifice (the Lamb) in our lives in the persecution by not returning evil for their evil. Luke says, the Flood came and destroyed them all, and Matthew says, the Flood came and took them all away. To be taken was to be destroyed, or die. It is a compound word composed of a preposition para meaning near and a verb, lambano meaning I receive. together. the Father; and as the Father gave me commandment, even so I do. Luke 16. Matthew 24:40-41; Luke 17:26-30, 34-36 And he said I tell you, in that night there will be two men in one bed: the one will be taken and the other will be left. Where will they be taken? (37) For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou Whereas the eagles in Matthew 24:28 gather around carcases, the eagles in Luke 17:37 gather around living bodies. It is described in Matthew 25:31-46. be the coming of the Son of Man. @Charlie I appreciate your research in finding a similar question; I searched it, but originally didn't see the Luke text, although the Matthew records almost the same discussion. Please see, Welcome and thank you for your contribution. It only takes a minute to sign up. All Rights Reserved. Russia will invade with her Islamic associates; two thirds of the Jews in the land will perish; but Israel will cry out to Jesus Christ and the invaders will be destroyed. For example, it is important to notice that in Luke 17:22 we are told that Jesus referred to the days of the Son of Man, and He did it again in Luke 17:30. 2 Thessalonians 2:6-8 KJV (6) And now ye know what withholdeth that gather., 37 "And answering they *said to Him, Where, Lord? And He said to This will "torment" them. In both passages Jesus is talking about the end of the age which is the 7 years of Great Tribulation immediately before Jesus comes. Then, Jesus gives another example for the same concept Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. 25 'Ye are sons of the prophets, and of the covenant that God made unto our fathers, saying unto Abraham: And in thy seed shall be blessed all the families of the earth; @ Constantthin: On reading your profile I noticed Proverbs 25:2 "It is the glory of God to conceal a matter" (NASB) God rightfully keeps some things secret from mankind until it is due to reveal them. They will not be able to receive His words and will gnash their teeth in rage towards what they hear. ptma G4430 is coprse, caracass. Luke 17:34-35, The Fate of the Raptured Posted on Saturday, October 11, 2014 in Bible Commentary | 1 comment I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. The word for taken in Luke 17:34 is the Greek word paralamban, which means to receive from and is the same Greek word that is used in John 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come back and take you to be with me that you also may be where I am. This seems to refer to Christ taking the church in the event of the rapture rather than some other sort of taken. whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you Perhaps it means that the ones taken will be disenfranchised, their goods confiscated and their rights terminated as a "felony". On that day, the one who is on the housetop and whose goods are in the house must not go down to take them out; and likewise the one who is in the field must not turn back. That judgment is the Goat and Sheep Judgment. Who will be devoured? good; or else make the tree corrupt, and his fruit corrupt: for the The time of Jacobs trouble (Jeremiah 30:7) will have arrived. knew nothing until the flood came and swept them all away, so too will We are to also not look behind to return evil for their evil that will certainly come out of their mouths as one leaves the churches of the unbelievers. You have to change eagles into vultures and the body into a carcass. that Lot left Sodom, it rained fire and sulfur from heaven and In one case those left are judged and in the other case those left are blessed! The CEB and the disciple who barely escaped Whenever a new Bible translation comes out, questions arise about changes to familiar passages. (35) Two women shall be grinding The people "left behind" - These are non Christians. Enter your email to receive new articles straight to your Inbox, The Herald of Hope Jesus Second Coming is for those who have believed in Him for the forgiveness of their sins. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh. They will "weary" themselves to get you to speak evil back so that they are justified in their own eyes. The carcase is Christ, or the body of Christ; the eagles are the saints, or true Christians; these, whatever happens, will, with keen spiritual sight, always be able to discern Christ and his body, and to flock thereto. In addition, the goat nations who receive the mark of the Beast during the Tribulation, will be brought before the throne of Christs glory and be cast into everlasting fire (Matthew 25:31-46). Write by: . He has revealed to us the" mystery of his will"(Ephesians 1:9) Learning about it can lead to salvation and can provide you with a glimpse into the Creator's unfathomable wisdom. Bible Based.We believe in solo-scriptura. 24 answer, and I originally didn't see the Luke 17 answer on CSE. That angels fly is derived from Dan 9:21: while I was still in prayer, Gabriel, the man I had seen in the earlier vision, came to me in swift flight about the time of the evening sacrifice. Thank you for contributing. Two shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. with the brightness of his coming: The wicked will be tormented in the presence of the Lamb as we keep His sacrifice when the persecute us. one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Sin is present in their multitude of words and this shall destroy them in Gods righteous judgment upon them. It is expedient that we go away.following Him out. We are not to return evil for their evil that will come out of their mouths as we leave their company. housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it ", [Jer 16:18 NKJV] 18 "And first I will repay double for their iniquity and their sin, because they have defiled My land; they have filled My inheritance with the carcasses of their detestable and abominable idols.". The words in the Olivet Discourse come after the Lord has given a chronological description of events following this Church age and lasting for the 7 years of the Tribulation, culminating in the glorious return of Christ to the earth to establish His kingdom and to reign on the throne of David. The literal meaning of the words must agree with the context. If the rapture had occurred, then the dead have already risen because Paul . He also expands on this here by saying "Likewise, no one in the field should go back for anything. Like the lightning that flashes in the sky, these phenomena in the heavens "illuminate" the Day of the Lord when the spiritually dead are judged on earth. Jesus indicated that the people taken will be killed when the disciples asked "taken where?" Some interpret the word taken to mean, taken in judgment at the second coming of Christ but what does the Greek word mean? The ones taken were saved and the ones left were the ones destroyed by the flood. Here is Luke 17:30-33, It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed. Then He said to the disciples, "It is impossible that no offenses should come, but woe to him through whom they do come! First I must acknowledge that faithful men may take a different view but the important thing is not to take any position simply because a particular scholar teaches it. together", 37 "Then[a] the disciples[b] said[c] to him, Where,[d] Lord? He Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life will preserve it. Comp., moreover, on Matthew 24:40 f. ] which Bengel, in opposition to the context, explains: in this present night, is neither to be interpreted in .

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